Tuesday, April 12, 2011
Your help/feedback
Could I please ask a question to the readers of the blog - I desperately want to do something to help improve tournament participation at our 2 day tournaments, I have serious concerns over participation numbers and the future of our tournaments. I am seeking feedback as to why people are not participating? Ideas on how we could stimulate growth of these tournaments? What is keeping people away? Any feedback would be greatly appreciated … thank you Sarah-Jane
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11 comments:
Really, nobody has any advise, suggestions, complaints in relation to 2 days tournaments ? Numbers and participation have fallen dramatically, I don’t believe that it is solely because of the economic down turn, participation levels have been dropping for the last few years, I have the numbers if anyone would like a copy, I would like to know why people are not attending, what could we be doing to get people back to the terrain?
I put my hand up to be on PNZ to be an advocate for social and semi competitive petanque players , I am not limited to 2 day tournaments, I am happy to challenge any part of the system you think needs improving but I really don’t want to waste my time if everyone’s happy with the status quo. If you don’t want to make comment on the forum please feel free to e-mail me. dezandsarah@xtra.co.nz
sorry forgot to put my name - Sarah-Jane
Sarah-Jane, Although I don't play anymore and keep a keen interest in what is going on and the lack of response to a very important question you have asked, actually gives you the answer you are seeking. It is called Apathy. Something that the Petanque fraternity suffers from really badly. You only have to look back at the article from Rita and the tributes to Bill Billing to see that no-one really is bothered.
There could be a very good discussion regarding the points you make.
Graeme Burnard
Thanks Graeme .... You are correct the lack of response does speak volumes!
I think you have hit the nail on the head with APATHY. I joined twilight bowls, those people are like a dog with a bone, if I didn’t turn up they would call me, they buddied me up with a partner, they got me involved in the interclub team (didn’t matter to them that I play most of my game on the adjoining green), they arranged training for free, leant me some bowls, all within 4 weeks of me joining, I almost felt obliged to play and turn up cause they had been so nice and inclusive. The complete opposite to petanque where the sentiment seems to be “if you don’t like it, don’t play”, nobody really seems to care.
I make no secret of the fact that I am a disgruntled player, who’s enthusiasm for petanque has waned over the recent years and not because I don’t enjoy the game, but for many reasons to long to list! I still don’t buy the whole “financial crisis” as the main reason for the sorry turn outs we have for tournaments, I don’t believe that people stop doing things they ENJOY when money is tight, I think they re-prioritize and I think Petanque has been moved down the priority list (and in a lot of cases, off!) as it doesn’t offer the enjoyment it once did ?
I think it is the PNZ’s responsibility to focus on how we move petanque back to the top of that list, I don’t think they have to do it alone, all regions and clubs should be part of this, but I think the direction and strategy has to come from the top.
I may be alone in my thinking and it would be helpful to know if I am, as I don’t want to wander off in the wrong direction and try to fix something that is not broken. But with out players input and without knowing what would encourage them back to terrain I am stuck, or maybe I just have to accept the fact that people are past it and are no longer interested . ?
Take Care
SJ
I wish I could offer a solution for this problem Sarah Jane, but I can only speak for myself when I say, I am only a fair weather player now. I wish tournaments wouldn’t start so early in the morning, a 10am start is what I‘d prefer and perhaps no more than 5 games per day, I'd also like to be at home by 6 pm. At the beginning of the petanque scene in NZ we used to take part in all competitions in Auckland or Rotorua, because it was the best way to improve your game and it was fun, but after 10 years of getting up at 7am on a Sunday morning, come home at around 8pm, because we used to stay to watch the final, which was the most exciting part of the day! (We never understood why people leave before the final game), I had enough of all day petanque competitions, we do take part at the PNZ Senior games but the main purpose of taking part is to visit that particular town as a tourist.
Rita.
Hi Rita
Thanks for your feedback. I remember back in 2007 when Rotorua attracted 48 teams, a large percentage of those players were senior player, I guess 5 years on those same player do not have the stamina to participate in 2 day tournaments an that is a contributing factor in the down turn in numbers at 2 day tournaments.
I am glad you are still competing at the senior level as it is important that all levels of petanque are catered for and I think PNZ and the regional bodies do a good job in this area.
Take Care
SJ
Sarah Jane
I believe a large percentage of players are sick of being the "contributors" to the winners purse without any real hope of competing.
if you look at almost all of the successful sports, they include some sort of handicap system so people are competing at their own level with the opportunity to move up a level if they do well.
Golf is the most obvious example, but it is not alone, rowing, boxing, weight lifting, chess, cards, bowls (You have to earn your right to become a skip) etc etc etc.
In fact it is almost impossible to find a sport that does not have a grading / handicap system. In fact I challenge anyone to name another sport wherby you can join the sport and the next day enter to compete in the Nationals!!!
There is also no coaching to speak of, and that which is available is typically done by people that have no real understanding of the sport.
What's more if we are really honest very few players actually play Petanque as a sport, they play it as a passtime.
Realistically, I think you could count on both hands the number of player who train (not just play games) but train at least more than an hour a day, five days a week, week in and week out and I believe those that train on the mental side of the game at least an hour a day would be lucky to be counted on one hand.
Given the above is it little wonder that people don't want to put themselves out to play two day tournaments.
To be a sport their needs to be a structure and people need to be prepared to put their hands in their pocket for proper sports training.
The current approach to Petanque is typified by questions like what is PNZ doing for me for my $10.00 annual fee. $10.00 as an annual fee and players expect something in return - $10.00 doesn't even cover the cost of maintaining membership lists.
Petanque needs to get real with itself if it wants to call itself a sport and charge real fees.
$50.00 affiliation fees and $10.00 per hour for level one coach training up to and in excess of $100.00 per hour for nation level coaching. Yes we might lose a few members but then they weren't playing Petanque as a sport as anyway, they just had a passtime.
Bet this gets some reaction, it better or we are doomed as a SPORT!!!
Grant Hackett
Hi Grants
Thanks for your comments.
Players sick of being contributors – I agree with this, I think we spent so long trying to attract top players to tournaments with the lure of trophy prize money that we forgot about the 80% of the other players that make up the tournament. We are now in a position were we need to draw back those people and shift our focus toward attracting them to the game, we also need to try and keep a balance of course because we don’t want to shift in the opposite direction either. I certainly think evening up the prize money across all divisions would be one step in the right direction. As winning the bowl or plate is no less a achievement than the trophy as in theory you are still playing against teams equal to your level of play. But to do this we need the buy in of tournament hosts clubs.
Coaching – Some coaching is taking place in a few Auckland clubs, sometime you have to go out and find it, as you say you can’t expect PNZ to provide everything for $10. I know of one club that has a top player every week for coaching and I have seen renewed enthusiasm for the game within that club because of this, It is really good to know that some “Top Players” are willing to give back and mentor other players.
Affiliation Fees – I agree this needs to be addressed, if we want to see change and progression in the sport we have to revisit our membership fees but we also need to be quite clear where the money will be used and how it will benefit the sport across all levels.
Thanks !
SJ
Getting a bit off track here but for what its worth my opinion is: Petanque in NZ is still in its infancy and its participant numbers reflect that. There has been a subtle shift in focus from the majority (fair weather or older social players) to the minority (serious competitors) which has had a detrimental effect across the board. It does not apply to all top players but there is a little too much ego going on at the moment "I have been to the worlds, I am too important to enter the little tournies, etc" The facts are there for all to see, we cannot beat the Tahitians in the NZ Open, yet the french came and beat them 13-0. But still our top players want to go to the worlds to take on the likes of the french !
We all need to work hard to increase our numbers, focus on the "average" club players and eventually the rest will fall into place. Also, the amount we pay in fee's has absolutely nothing to do with any of it, if it such a small amount how come people are not queuing up to join our clubs?
In short, get back to basics, focus on the currently ignored 80%, work hard to expand the membership, the so called "top players" are only top in NZ let them walk before they can run and not waste time money and effort sending them to the worlds.
Without the average club player petanque in NZ would wither away to nothing, wake up !!!!!!!!
ok go for it !
Alan Heron
Cockle Bay/St George
I'm with Grant on 'grading. We need at least three recognised levels or tiers with an annual promotion/relegation factor. And NO - missing the cut on the first day and competing on the second day in the plate or the bowl is NOT grading.
Rotorua ruined their tournament by turning the terrain into a 'rockpile'. It used to be fun there - it no longer is and the sharp stones wear out very expensive boules. You won't find those kind of terrains anywhere in Europe. A world champs had one once apparently and thats why we are now getting them. Well, as has already been said - nobody here is up to World Champs standard anyway - on any kind of piste - so lets make the game enjoyable again for the majority - not just for the 'guns'.
Personally, I like the 2 day tournaments(not neccessarily the formats) and attend most of them all over New Zealand. I also like six games in a day - makes me feel as if I'm getting value for all my travel and accommodation costs - but still realize that that is not what everybody wants.
Agree with Sarah too on being made welcome. One or two were very friendly and welcoming when I first started playing - but many were not and a little clique of the 'elite' were downright rude.
Summing up then: we need to have grades, we need to be friendly, we need to cater for Joe Blow instead of Derek Up Himself, we need a mixture of pistes to cater for both serious and social players - and we need to have fun.
Cheers for now,
Bob Bridge
From him overseas giving his two-pennith.
1 Five games a day is enough (reason being when one is away it is nice to get out and see the city you are in and catch up with the players from other centres).
2 here is an idea - you play the first day in groups then at the endof the day tyhe next days groups are made up the following way -
All the players who topped their group go into group 1
All the players who got second in their group go into group 2
All the players who got third in their group go into group three
Etc
Now what this does is make sure that players are playing against people of the same standard and thus enjoy their games much more and don't go to the tournament knowing they will probably get nowhere.
All those who then win their group get the same prize (n there is no reason why the top players should get more than any other winner of their group.
Start times should be 10am with the games up to the semi-finals going to 11 points and the semis and the finals to 13 points.
We have done this beefore in Squash opens and it worked wonderfully and increased participayion by some 38% ir more in some clubs.
hope you are all in good health and still good tossers (in ptanque that is)
Paul O'Connor
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